Faith in Jesus Christ

I believe there are different kinds of faith; thus, there are different kinds of assurances, etc. Nevertheless, there is one type of faith that should guide us in this life: faith in Jesus Christ. It's interesting to talk to someone about what they think faith is. It's also interesting to note how different people understand faith. The following is concisely what I believe faith is:

The Word of God

To understand faith, it helps to understand what God's word is. God's word is not just the black ink on white paper. It is not merely truth received by the intellect. The word of God lives just as Jesus Christ lives. God's word is living truth. It is spirit. It is light (1)(2).

Faith comes to us by hearing the word of God (3). Faith can come by means of hearing a person preach, but we must hear the word of God by the Spirit (4). It is conceived in our heart from the Holy Ghost.

The word of God is God speaking directly to you. Essentially, the word of God is revelation. That is how faith in Christ comes to us.

Assurance by the Word

To understand faith, it helps to understand what assurance is; even the greatest form of assurance.

Faith, in its very nature, is spiritual. Faith is of assurance by the power of the Spirit:

5. For our gospel came not unto you in word only, but also in power, and in the Holy Ghost, and in much assurance; (1 Thessalonians 1)

Faith is receiving those assurances by revelation. From Words of Joseph Smith:

...in 1835 Joseph Smith wrote to his uncle Silas to convince him that revelation was still necessary, reasoning that the modern Saints...[should receive revelation] just as their ancient counterparts had received such assurances by revelation.

Assurance from God is the greatest assurance we can receive. Ezra Taft Benson said:

This, then, is the supreme assurance for the honest in heart-to know by personal revelation from God that the Book of Mormon is true. (Teachings of Presidents of the Church: Ezra Taft Benson)

We learn truths by revelation. We are to walk in faith. We continue to exercise our faith by those assurances because we know they come from Christ (5).

The supreme assurance we receive is by God's word, which is by revelation, which is spirit. When God tells us to do something, we should be assured that it can be accomplished.

What is Faith?

I really love Hebrews 11 and think it is a masterful and persuasive sermon on faith in Jesus Christ; especially if we understand the most powerful form of assurance is God's word. We all have faith granted unto us by Jesus Christ; for we couldn't do anything without faith, like even opening a door. Perhaps the faith we are to nurture is the faith in Christ. We are to seek faith in Christ, rooted in His word and more importantly, His will (6, see JST).

All are given power to act, all are given the light of Christ, all have the gift of agency (A). On the other hand, if it is received by the word of God, it must also be His will. This is where the the power of faith in Christ comes. Faith is given to all men; we couldn't even move if it wasn't for faith:

46. And the Spirit giveth light to every man that cometh into the world;

But it is faith in Christ that enlightens us to act:

46. ...and the Spirit enlighteneth every man through the world, that hearkeneth to the voice of the Spirit. (D&C 84)

We must use our agency (our ability to move and act by our own dictate, powered by faith) to make our will His will (which is seeking faith in Christ).

Dead Works

The Jews stumbled because of the new covenant, which is faith in Christ. They were used to the strictness of the law, wherein if they kept the law then they were justified. By breaking it in one little piece, they broke the whole law. But faith in Christ brought mercy, and we are justified by faith in Jesus Christ which brings about mercy. If there was a law given that could save us, it would have been given to us; but no such law exists. Thus, faith in Jesus Christ is what saves (7).

The law does not have power to save, only to condemn. Faith in Christ was always meant to be the spiritual counterpart to the law. We are to obey His voice and promptings (8).

Paul taught in Romans 9:

32 Wherefore? Because they sought it not by faith, but as it were by the works of the law. For they stumbled at that stumblingstone [Christ];

They could not exercise faith in Christ sufficiently because they didn't believe in Him and therefore stumbled.

Justified by Faith in Christ

We are condemned by the law, but by faith in Christ we are justified:

22 But the scripture hath concluded all under sin, that the promise by faith of Jesus Christ might be given to them that believe. (Galatians 3)

Justification is by the Spirit, not by the law. It is righteousness in faith by His word. In everything we do, whether by covenant, by the law, by ordinances, by commandment; we must do so by faith in Jesus Christ, received from Him (9). For every law and ordinance there is a spiritual counterpart we must receive; it is also the Holy Spirit of Promise that seals our faith in righteousness (10).

Receive Faith

Now that we know what faith is, that it is received from hearing the word of God, which is the greatest assurance we can receive; now what? All we have to do is sit around until we have faith by receiving His word, right? On the contrary; we must actively seek and receive faith, just as we would seek revelation.

7. Ask, and it shall be given unto you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you. (3 Nephi 14; see also, 11)

Our days should actively be sought in prayer to receive guidance. We should pray always and direct our thoughts towards Him. I believe He can show us how to do this. Being humble is a necessary part of receiving faith. If receiving faith in Jesus Christ is receiving faith from Him, then we receive it according to His will (12).

Types of Faith

Ministering by the Spirit and working miracles is not by the law, but can only be by faith (13). This is why there is "faith unto repentance" (14), "faith unto salvation" (15), and "faith unto mighty works" (16).

Noah could not have built a boat had he not first received the assurance of the word of God to do so (faith).

Moses could not have parted the sea, had he not first received the assurance of the word of God to do so (faith).

And "By faith Abraham, when he was tried, offered up Isaac: and he that had received the promises offered up his only begotten son" (Hebrews 11:17).

Exercise Faith

We know that "faith without works is dead" (17). We can exercise that assurance we receive by God's word, just like Nephi knew he could get the plates of Laban, and was led by the spirit to accomplish it. God commanded Him to do so, despite "not knowing beforehand the things which [he] should do" (1 Nephi 4:6).

Once Nephi was commanded, "it [was] not meet that [God] should command in all things". Once commanded by God, it was up to Nephi to exercise and act according to the faith he received.

27. Verily I say, men should be anxiously engaged in a good cause, and do many things of their own free will, and bring to pass much righteousness (D&C 58)

Nephi had to figure out how to get the plates, and it took him many tries to do so. He was not compelled, but always kept trying by his own free will. We should always pray that the Spirit will be with us and consecrate our actions for our good:

5 For behold, again I say unto you that if ye will enter in by the way, and receive the Holy Ghost, it will show unto you all things what ye should do. (2 Nephi 32)

I think the greatness of our faith depends on how we carry out our faith. The Lord granted the brother of Jared much agency in choosing how to light the barges (18). It is certain that through his life he had continuously exercised his faith by God's word. Certainly, the brother of Jared became very well acquainted with His voice.

It's important with our faith to exercise it carefully. Not with a "doubtful heart" or "with slothfulness" (19). Rather:

7. But ye are commanded in all things to ask of God, who giveth liberally; and that which the Spirit testifies unto you even so I would that ye should do in all holiness of heart, walking uprightly before me, considering the end of your salvation, doing all things with prayer and thanksgiving, that ye may not be seduced by evil spirits, or doctrines of devils, or the commandments of men; for some are of men, and others of devils. (D&C 46)

Connecting Faith and Revelation

As we progress in faith in Christ, we will receive more revelations and commandments meant for us personally (20):

1 ...whatsoever things you shall ask in faith, with an honest heart, believing that you shall receive a knowledge...
2 Yea, behold, I will tell you in your mind and in your heart, by the Holy Ghost, which shall come upon you and which shall dwell in your heart.
3 Now, behold, this is the spirit of revelation; behold, this is the spirit by which Moses brought the children of Israel through the Red Sea on dry ground. (D&C 8; also, 21)

Many others used the same faith (22). Revelation is a great assurance of faith and one to strive for.

The End of Faith

We all understand that faith is not a perfect knowledge (23). However, the end of faith is that we fulfill God's commandment and obtain His promises. When we fulfill that commandment, or when we see His promise fulfilled, we then have a perfect knowledge. We saw that God's word was true and fulfilled in the exercising of our faith (24). Sometimes the exercising of our faith can last a long time until it is fulfilled.

After our faith has been proven time and time again by fulfilling God's commandments, our faith in God will become unshakable. This is the end of faith in Jesus Christ:

19. And because of the knowledge of this man he could not be kept from beholding within the veil; and he saw the finger of Jesus, which, when he saw, he fell with fear; for he knew that it was the finger of the Lord; and he had faith no longer, for he knew, nothing doubting.
20 Wherefore, having this perfect knowledge of God, he could not be kept from within the veil; therefore he saw Jesus; and he did minister unto him. (Ether 3)

Therefore, "plant the word in your hearts, that ye may try the experiment of its goodness" (Alma 34:4).

***LETTERED & NUMBERED REFERENCES***

A. Lectures on Faith:

If men were duly to consider themselves, and turn their thoughts and reflections to the operations of their own minds, they would readily discover that it is faith, and faith only, which is the moving cause of all action, in them; that without it, both mind and body, would be in a state of inactivity, and all their exertions would cease, both physical and mental.

1. D&C 84:45
2. 1 John 5:7
3. Romans 10:17
4. 2 Nephi 33:1
5. 2 Timothy 3:14
6. Hebrews 11:1b(JST)-3
7. Galatians 3:21-23
8. D&C 29:34-35
9. Galatians 2:16
10. D&C 76:53-54
11. D&C 88:63
12. James 4:3, 7-8
13. Galatians 3:2-5
14. Alma 34:15-18
15. 1 Peter 1:5
16. D&C 63:11
17. James 2:20
18. Ether 2:25
19. D&C 58:29
20. Mosiah 2:24
21. Hebrews 11:29
22. Hebrews 11:4-37
23. Alma 32:26
24. D&C 58:29-33

My Path Away From Denver Snuffer

Note: 
**Let me inform all readers of my unworthiness. I don’t ask that you think I am right or wrong.
**I would ask, however, that you (anyone) merely consider my post. I put it together quickly, but I left myself bare to all, exposing all my weaknesses. Again, please consider my words and forgive me and take what truths are there. Please go to God.
**Denver once stated, "The truth is always about the underlying message. Does the message cause you to awake? Does it cause you to arise?" Please oversee my sins and find the truth that is needed.

UPDATE--31 March, 2016: Looking back, I think I was a little overzealous in my efforts. I don't want in any way to condemn Denver Snuffer nor those who "follow" him. I still disagree with his path, but I do feel some remorse in how hard I came across. I'm sorry for thinking that I know where he is in life or who I think he may be. That doesn't matter. I knew that before. I was trying to express why that path was not mine anymore. I'm sorry I condemned him or those associated. I wish him and everyone else the best.

This blogpost is dedicated to those who associate themselves to Denver Snuffer. I fully disclose that I was on the cusp of re-baptism a couple months ago. I talked to my bishop and was ready to be excommunicated. I still thank Denver Snuffer and John Pontius. I can better understand and apply the Gospel in my life.

I was taught true, saving principles. I saw how they worked in my life. My spiritual experiences multiplied in number and magnitude. Then as one man's journey veered, unfortunately mine did too. In my journey, I found that some of my unbelief in certain things were justified; my unbelief in man, for instance. Was the Spirit still with me in my deception? Yes, it was. I've learned that God is no respecter of persons, and that even in our wrong paths, no matter how dark or sinful it may be, God will always stretch out His hands. We will be called to pass through these tests at times. It takes true discipleship in Christ to overcome all things. Just living in this Babylonian world, it will happen; it is happening now if we don't entirely submit our lives to Him. Even when we do, it is only by His grace that we overcome. In this, we can only give the glory to God and not by our own self-righteousness.

I’m grateful to God to help me. It just proves my dependence on Him in my fallen state in this world. I'm grateful for those who reached out in love and concern; yet, even that couldn't help me. I know it was the prayers that were made in my behalf; to me there is no other explanation. Thanks also to my unknown friend, Miguel. I'm still working out many things, but my place is here with the LDS Church. I apologize for offending anyone in my strayed path. My search is never complete. I hope to never pretend I have all the truth. After all, faith requires revelation; and how often do we receive the gift of faith? Often, I hope. I hope we believe and exercise the gift of faith in all the examples taught in the Book of Mormon. I hope we claim and act in these promises God has given us.

What we need is long-suffering, patience, unity, and love towards members of the church; not another division. We can carry on with the Spirit of the Gospel that Denver Snuffer taught us so well; but we are in great need of outstanding members to stay with the Church that Joseph Smith restored and continue on towards the goal of Zion. Forcing our views is neither wise nor charitable. It’s obvious there are faults in the church. Pres. Uchtdorf acknowledged this publicly. But perhaps this “Old Boat Zion” really will lead us to “the brink of hell”, temporarily perhaps, and then on to Zion (1). It will sift as needed. It is the Church that delivered us all the true Gospel of Jesus Christ (e.g.—by means of preserving the Book of Mormon).

Denver Snuffer has Fallen

I had the following dream on November 29, 2012 that I recorded:

I dreamed I was on a journey. At first I was in a car with friends whom I did not know. Then I saw the woman that was driving purposefully crash. After the wreck, I left on my own and searched again for this woman who departed after the crash. I wanted to be with this woman. Then I caught her with another man in adultery. I then gave up on her because of her sin.
I’ll end my dream there.

I have continuously read Denver’s messages almost for the past 3 years. I recently rediscovered this dream of catching him in a spirit of adultery/apostasy. I understand there is an apostasy from the Gospel, but his is an apostasy of rebellion, fault-seeking, and leaving the church (but never denying the truth).

The apostasy of Denver Snuffer mirrors Sydney Rigdon’s. Like Sydney, Denver “felt [his excommunication] was done without proper order.” Like Sydney, Denver “refused to attend [his] trial”. Like Sydney, Denver “in turn, likewise [essentially] excommunicated the members of the Twelve” (quotes from Wikipedia). I fear Denver may end up the same.

The Danger of Knowledge

Just because a messenger gives truth does not mean he/she is a true messenger. What I mean by the above is that Denver’s knowledge exceeds that of most members in the church. Of course knowledge is not a bad thing. In fact, it is necessary; but there is power in knowledge and it can be abused. Satan has power over us because of our lack of knowledge (2).

I wonder who was likely a better and more skilled teacher. Brigham or Sydney? Who had greater knowledge, Brigham or Sydney? Sydney received great revelations and visions right alongside Joseph Smith. Brigham did not hold as great of a claim on revelation, but sometimes used Heber C. Kimball as his revelator. To those who follow Denver Snuffer, the answer to these questions is obvious. In the end, we were left with Brigham Young; which even Denver agrees was the better decision.

Fight for Inheritance

Much like in Joseph’s last dream, the apostates would always seek to claim his inheritance from the church. The apostates would fight over it, but it was found without the foundation of prophets and apostles. They, as Joseph Smith once said, “mock at authority”. But the apostates can have that “old barn” (D&C 121:16–25).

What if the Brethren really are right that we stay with the old ship Zion? Why must it be such a test to not lift up the heal against the Brethren and stay in the boat? Why must we always lose our greatest saints? Because of my family’s faithfulness over many years, I was able to inherit the knowledge of how to seek the light of the Gospel.

A Sieve in Our Midst

As the pattern of apostasy always happens, so did Denver Snuffer and many before him like Sydney. In Isaiah 22, there is prophesied an “evil servant” that is replaced by “a faithful and wise servant”. I say wait a little longer until the servant will come to put in order the church. Those “found to have apostatized, or to have been cut off from the church” will not find an inheritance (D&C 85:7–12). Much like the barn in Joseph’s dream.

Brother Snuffer, why did you have to follow so closely the path of Sydney Rigdon? The church is always left with the weakest of saints already. Why must there be another division? The church is yet coming out of the wilderness and going through purification (and more to come), despite our condemnation. Stay with the old boat and teach us poorly saints.

Heber C. Kimball warned the saints in 1856:

“We think we are secure in the chambers of the everlasting hills, but the time will come when we will be so mixed up that it will be difficult to tell the face of a Saint from the face of an enemy to the people of God. Then, brethren, look out for the great sieve, for there will be a great sifting time, and many will fall; for I say unto you there is a test, a test, a TEST coming, and who will be able to stand?”

It’s interesting that our covenants are attached to the church, but we are willing to break those covenants we made. Maybe it’s not about the membership, but our covenants. We made that covenant in front of God and angels, yet we are willing to walk away. Zion is still the last stop of this old ship. It will be set in order.

Heber C. Kimball stated:

“I know the day is right at hand when men will forfeit their Priesthood and turn against us and against the covenants they have made, and they will be destroyed as Judas was.”

Priesthood Still Among Us

There have still been others after Brigham who have had an audience with Christ, including Denver Snuffer! President John Taylor, President Joseph F. Smith and David B. Haight. Perhaps most recently, Elder Packer from his testimony in the April 2014 General Conference; proof enough the priesthood in the Church is valid and alive, despite even Denver’s condemnation against it at that very time Elder Packer gave his testimony.

“’For we saw him” (D&C 76:22–23). Their words are my words.”—Elder Packer, April 2014 General Conference

His words are clear enough; and what timing as Denver claimed otherwise (3).

Stay Together

Like Denver Snuffer said, “Joseph Smith suggested the church needed to stay together.” If a church can be condemned, and yet one can still receive those blessings as Elder Packer has testified of around the time of April 2014, then so can members today. Joseph Smith said, “Do not watch for iniquity in each other, if you do you will not get an endowment, for God will not bestow it on such”. It possibly goes the same for watching for iniquity of the church.
Even I became a little inactive in the Church; but I have yet to come across anyone at church to know of Denver Snuffer (I’m on the East coast). Maybe he fulfilled his part and fell away. There is much work to do in the church, but why ditch the saints? Wouldn’t we at least still work with them, even alongside them?

Teaching true principles of faith and repentance will enable enough of the slumbering saints. Is it not still true that this is still the church Joseph restored? It has lived this long, why give up now? There is evidence enough of a type of apostasy since Denver’s fall. His knowledge is greater than the members, and what a dangerous situation that is in his apostasy; a strong delusion that would make, indeed.

Justified by the Spirit

We cannot get wrapped up in the law; for we are only justified by the spirit. Just don’t get wrapped up in the spirit of apostasy. 

Usually, matters of the law are of very important to the apostate. It was for pharisaic Jews as well. Yes, there are some laws that, as a Church, we have done away with. However, we should know better that we are justified by the Spirit. We live the law according to our faith in Christ, not of the law itself. That is true for any law in the Church. Faith in Christ is dependent on being guided by His Spirit.

7 That being justified by his grace, we should be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life. (Titus 3)

9 But avoid foolish questions, and genealogies, and contentions, and strivings about the law; for they are unprofitable and vain.
10 A man that is an heretick after the first and second admonition reject;
11 Knowing that he that is such is subverted, and sinneth, being condemned of himself. (Titus 3, see also the ESV version of the Bible)

Be Ye Followers

I agree that we are to obey God directly. I admit that in the end, we follow God and seek His spirit; but sometimes, do we still follow someone in the process? In other words, are we going to choose the Brethren or Denver in the process? I’ve been where you are. It would be hypocrisy for those who follow Denver to say we choose to follow the Brethren. How many would be re-baptized, have sacrament with wine, etc., if it wasn’t for Denver? The Church did not say to do this. Joseph Smith authorized sacrament of water. We have an authorized baptism by a commissioned church; but in the end, we are justified by the Spirit. That is the whole point. Following someone else’s suggestion of keeping the commandments won’t make it any different as long as we keep our covenants and have faith in Christ.

Joseph Smith spoke of Paul’s people to be on par with Enoch’s. If they still needed to follow a prophet then so do we, no matter your spiritual stature. Maybe there is something to the Brethren holding these mysterious “keys” in guiding us. Paul taught:

16 Wherefore I beseech you, be ye followers of me.(1 Corinthians 4)

I actually believe it was the Corinthians whom Joseph Smith called Paul’s people. Paul appeared to preach them doctrine beyond the baptism of fire and the Holy Ghost. Yet, Denver seems to think that following the Brethren will corrupt the restoration. But rather:

24 Not for that we have dominion over your faith, but are helpers of your joy: for by faith ye stand. (2 Corinthians 1)

Even if all the leaders are at fault, then it’s our responsibility to “exceed the[ir] righteousness” and be a testimony to them (Matthew 5: 20). If we need to be more righteous, then let’s do so. The Brethren, nor anyone else, need tell us to do so. So, are we going to choose to follow men still claiming an audience with Christ (like Elder Packer)? Or, are we going to choose to follow someone that criticizes (which has always been a hindrance to the restoration)? Which one is God guiding? 

It’s the Criticism

John Pontius didn’t feel it was in his work to do what Denver was doing, either. John passed away faithfully in the church. It’s interesting how much he would have known, and yet know the condition of the church; but he never raised his heal against the brethren, and how many in the church were better because of his faithfulness? So it is with all of those who fell away from the church. We need them just as much to stay in the church. Again, maybe it’s not about our membership, but our covenants which are connected to the church.
It’s interesting to note John’s words:

“But, we [Snuffer and Pontius] have spent a few hours discussing the subject of criticism of the Brethren and the Church, whether the criticism is true or not. Simply stated, he and I do not agree on this subject. I do not criticize the Church simply because it isn’t my calling. I don’t fault the Brethren because it doesn’t change anything. I wouldn’t publish something outlining whatever flaws I might detect merely because I most assuredly do not see the candle as extinguished.

“Whatever flaws exist are irrelevant in my opinion. They are irrelevant because I personally have enjoyed a full measure of blessings the gospel promises, without being limited by whatever flaws exist – and frankly, it seems, so has Denver.”

I wonder what brother Pontius would say now.

See what the scriptures and Joseph Smith say of criticism, judging, fault-seeking, etc. It is a spirit of apostasy, and something we should stay away from. In his first lecture, Denver told of a woman named Monty. Maybe she rightfully warned him, “You beware of pride.”

I think, rather, it’s the spirit of criticism that has always been an enemy to the church and the restoration. Isn’t that more obvious? That has always been the case in the restoration.

Opposition in All Things

I was so quick to follow Denver that I neglected to search the other side–to stay in the church. I needed to search both polar opposites. I used to be angry going to church because of the false teachings. Now that I’ve distanced myself from Denver, I’ve taken the good from him and left what I believe was a spirit of apostasy in me. I now have a greater love for the members. Being in church doesn’t irritate me anymore. I just have a greater compassion and love for the saints. I teach them the things I have learned that have brought me closer to Christ. It was my trouble with the criticisms that kept me from moving forward.

I believe criticism and the spirit of apostasy is what we should avoid. Unity is required to build Zion; but criticism, rather than building up the saints by teaching and long suffering, will not bring about Zion. I still see many faithful and humble seekers in the church that could use that. Division seems to be the answer for criticism.

Wait for the One Mighty and Strong

For those who think Denver is the one mighty and strong, he is not. He so declared himself that he is not that one:

“Leave it for God to decide when we have done enough to justify Him moving His hand again to restore that which was lost. What need is there for a family head if there is no family to organize? When He does that, it will be through ‘a descendant of Jesse, as well as of Joseph, unto whom rightly belongs the priesthood, and the keys of the kingdom, for an ensign, and for the gathering of my people in the last days.’ (D&C 113:6.)”

This means that he was not to put the church in order. This means he is not an authorized servant. This also means, I believe, that he is a fallen prophet; guiding others where he is not authorized. Stay rather with the church that Joseph Smith restored.

Turn yourselves fervently to the scriptures; the revelation will increase. Turn away from blogs that teach doctrine for those with itching ears. Abase yourselves and stay with the flock.

Consider

I was part of the FaceBook group LDS Remnant. I was ready to be baptized. My wife did not want me to be in that group because she thought it was toxic of criticism. Frankly, I was ashamed at some things that were said as well.
When speaking to the bishop, my family, or friends, there was nothing they could teach me, say to me, or do to make me change my mind in my efforts towards re-baptism. However, I promised my wife that I would honestly seek the other side of what I was doing. I needed to search out why staying in the church would be necessary. Part of receiving the gift of faith is in searching. Opposition in all things, right? 

I wrote an email to a friend I had made a few years earlier, and what he said made me consider; just consider. That was all that was needed to spark something inside me. I opened up to my wife in a whole new way. The Spirit poured out on me. I was more open towards her, was more loving, was more humble. My marriage would have changed, and I almost damaged it. I left the group. Then I felt to post what my friend wrote me on that FaceBook group, without comment. I had to convince my wife that was all I was doing to rejoin. When I did so, I was shocked at the reaction I received. I don’t think it lasted but an hour or two before my post with my friend’s words was deleted entirely. My intention of seeking truth was questioned, among other things. I didn’t defend myself. Not only was I rejected in my own church, but also in the group I was planning to join through baptism. I don’t hold any grudges or even blame any of them. I do know that nobody, no group, no church is perfect. I despise the corrosive effects of judging and criticizing. Now sometimes I feel like I’m a loner, rejected on both sides. It takes courage to go to church, but I actually feel love towards them. God then began teaching me why staying in the church is what I needed to do (despite all its weakness), and how following Denver was not the right path.

The rest of my dream that I shared earlier? I was walking towards the mountains with my fellow saints that I knew in the church. I had a hood on my head to hide my face. I was ashamed for something. Now I know why. I almost abandoned my friends. I can only say now to all you who choose to follow Denver Snuffer to simply consider, as I once did.

Re-Enter the Fold

A non-member, Sols Caurdisto, had a vision in 1933. I hope we can find value in what she said:

“I saw your people draw closer and closer together, as this became more tense and as the spiritual forces warned them through the mouth of your elders and your other officers. I saw the spiritual forces influencing those members who had drifted away, to re-enter the fold. I saw a greater tithing than ever before. I saw vast quantities of necessaries supplied by members whose spiritual eyes had been opened. I saw a liquidation of properties and effects disposed of quietly but quickly by members of the church, as the spiritual influences directed them.”

Zion is yet to come. We’ve seen in the past what the sheer forces of the Church can do when we come together. When this call comes, it will be powerful to see. Come and re-enter the fold.

Numbered References:

(1) “Brethren, this Church will be led onto the very brink of hell by the leaders of this people. Then God will raise the one mighty and strong spoken of in the 85th Section of the Doctrine and Covenants, to save and redeem this church.” —Brigham Young

(2) “…A man is saved no faster than he gets knowledge, for if he does not get knowledge, he will be brought into captivity by some evil power in the other world, as evil spirits will have more knowledge, and consequently more power than many men who are on the earth. Hence it needs revelation to assist us, and give us knowledge of the things of God.”—Joseph Smith

(3) “Last general conference, the entire First Presidency, the 12, the 70, and all other general authorities and auxiliaries, voted to sustain those who abused their authority in casting me out of the church. At that moment, the Lord ended all claims of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, to claim it is led by the priesthood. They have not practiced what He requires. The Lord has brought about His purposes.”—Denver Snuffer

LATER ADDITION:

A Law Unto Themselves

I believe that Denver Snuffer is skillfully turning us against the appointed channels we've been given, the Church which was restored through Joseph Smith. The law was given through him. The Church was the appointed vehicle to bring about and preserve the truth. But now, Denver Snuffer, who has turned against the Church has become a “law unto [himself]” .(D&C 88:35). This is the concept that has been in my mind. Denver is not the first to try and do this, yet all like him have claimed the rights have been taken away. The people are truly perishing for “lack of knowledge”. These are indeed confusing times and perhaps that's why it must take one mighty and strong. I've searched talks in the past, and there are many about this concept.

We've been given the ordinances, and even Denver is a testament to those ordinances to be yet burning. It was by his faith in Christ unto the fulfilling of the law and ordinance. It is my opinion that he has become a law unto himself. I suggest that only the one mighty and strong can initiate the following he has garnered. It is such.

I strongly suggest reading a talk by Charles W. Penrose called “The Gospel–A Practical and Comprehensive Religion, and the Means of Eternal Exaltation”. I believe he expounds upon this concept better than I can. I promise it is worthwhile to read. Maybe start to read where it begins, “All these ordinances and ceremonies instituted by the Almighty…” and then onward.

Find the talk here:

http://jod.mrm.org/21/351

Update

I don't have time to give an update of where I stand. But I will share this if you have time to read it all. It gives many of my current views. Please give it a chance:

http://voiceofwarning.blogspot.com/2010_03_01_archive.html

Consider

How much can our reactions harm us? How much truth do we reject because of our reactions?

Sometimes I wonder if our reactions are a good gauge of our real intentions for seeking truth. Are we angry, bothered, uncomfortable? Do we laugh, mock, debate? Are we hesitant or fearful? Fools have mocked and scorned great men of faith and of science. Instead, their reaction to truth and knowledge should be of non-judgment. Everyone has something important to say. So, how do we engage information? 

I propose that we consider. Do we think about what is being said? Do we ask for clarification and meaning? Do we ask questions? In this way the information can come to us unfiltered and then ready to judge.

In order to not judge something to be evil or good, at first, we must withhold judgment altogether. Then we can judge righteously.

14 Wherefore, take heed, my beloved brethren, that ye do not judge that which is evil to be of God, or that which is good and of God to be of the devil.

Wait! Just consider the information. Don't judge yet!

15 For behold, my brethren, it is given unto you to judge, that ye may know good from evil; and the way to judge is as plain, that ye may know with a perfect knowledge, as the daylight is from the dark night.
16 For behold, the Spirit of Christ is given to every man, that he may know good from evil; wherefore, I show unto you the way to judge; for every thing which inviteth to do good, and to persuade to believe in Christ, is sent forth by the power and gift of Christ; wherefore ye may know with a perfect knowledge it is of God.
17 But whatsoever thing persuadeth men to do evil, and believe not in Christ, and deny him, and serve not God, then ye may know with a perfect knowledge it is of the devil; for after this manner doth the devil work, for he persuadeth no man to do good, no, not one; neither do his angels; neither do they who subject themselves unto him.
18 And now, my brethren, seeing that ye know the light by which ye may judge, which light is the light of Christ, see that ye do not judge wrongfully; for with that same judgment which ye judge ye shall also be judged.
19 Wherefore, I beseech of you, brethren, that ye should search diligently in the light of Christ that ye may know good from evil; and if ye will lay hold upon every good thing, and condemn it not, ye certainly will be a child of Christ. (Book of Mormon, Moroni, Moroni 7)

It is wrong to judge something outright as good or evil. Hopefully we do prepare ourselves for truth, and maybe we can aim rightly at the target of truth when it presents itself before us. It would be nice to be conditioned for truth and welcome it with open arms. In my experience, it doesn't always work that way. Truth can be hard. It can pierce. It can cause hurt. But righteous judgment requires that we consider it. In fact, I don't think it's possible to judge righteously without first considering. Then, once we have taken the information, understood it as it was meant from the communicator–considered it–then we can discern more fully whether it will draw us closer to Christ or not.

Withholding judgment is not indifference. It allows considering information then righteous judgment. I propose it as a spiritual maturity. 

On the other hand, I don't believe judgment is ever intended against one another. It's also knowing of our fallen state and our sameness in the nature of humanity. We must not only withhold judgment from one another, but forgive any offenses before they even occur. This leaves judgment always in God's hands. We are to judge against certain things and information; never one another. Ultimately, judgment really is the Lord's.

I'm not a fan of debate. Both parties press their own agendas without taking much time to consider. I'll put it this way, the main focal point of a debate is not to consider. In fact, I'm completely content in someone not accepting my views. I can't force it upon them; but you can always have a person consider. You can always propose. You can always invite and persuade.

45 And charity suffereth long, and is kind, and envieth not, and is not puffed up, seeketh not her own, is not easily provoked, thinketh no evil, and rejoiceth not in iniquity but rejoiceth in the truth, beareth all things, believeth all things, hopeth all things, endureth all things. (Book of Mormon, Moroni, Moroni 7)

You see what I mean? Considering allows us to react in love. It encourages discussion and it grows and flourishes. It does not destroy and tear down everything altogether until there's a victor. The goal for both sides is that truth prevails. We have to consider, ponder, and meditate in order to believe, hope, and endure all things. Who knows where the discussion will lead? Unity? Overcoming fallacies? Knowledge? It may change the way you see the person and you will love him/her more. It's interesting that the two scriptures I share come from the same chapter.

In a very real way, we all are conditioned against truth in our fallen state and nature. It's the devil's tactic that we react and overreact to truth. We usually learn precept by precept; the milk. Revelation is much more direct; the meat. Both ways are necessary. A spiritual creature is more accepting and sensitive to truth. Whether spiritually or carnally-minded, there should be room to consider. On the other hand, we should be alarmed and take caution if our reaction is anger. If we react in any way which prevents us from considering something towards understanding, we should reassess ourselves. So, let us approach with confidence towards true understanding, knowing God will steer us aright with righteous judgment. Even when there is disagreement, we still leave room to find wisdom and truth in a discussion. So, let us first consider. In doing so, no matter who is wrong or right, I promise both parties will be edified.

7 Consider what I say; and the Lord give thee understanding in all things. (2 Timothy 2)

Extra:

13 He that answereth a matter before he heareth it, it is folly and shame unto him. (Old Testament, Proverbs, Proverbs 18)

My Path

I'm writing this to disclose the path I have chosen. I want to explain in my own words, as simply and clearly as I can, why I am choosing this path:

Ever since I was little I enjoyed stories from the scriptures about the ministering of angels, the great faith of the Brother of Jared, and Moses seeing God's face. I'll admit that I was intrigued. Those people were well acquainted and familiar with the voice of the Lord. I want the same faith.

Prophets play an important role in God's plan. They have been indispensable in showing the human family how to approach God. Prophets teach us that faith must be placed only in God. I've always felt that salvation is between God and myself–nobody else. After all, the source of all power comes from God.

In church I grew up with the ideal of the importance of following the prophet. If you do, you won't be led astray. I'm not going to get into whether prophets can lead you astray or not. My concern is whether this modern teaching(1) will make us reach higher. Will we grow comfortable to their trust and heed to all the words of the prophet? Do we acknowledge our duties and responsibilities in seeking God's voice and take the Spirit as our sole guide (2)?

Now I see the Book of Mormon as a guide that shows me how to truly seek God–face to face. The baptism of fire and the Holy Ghost, making your calling and election made sure, and the Second Comforter are all important principles to me. The baptism of fire and the Holy Ghost is the minimum requirement for entrance into the Celestial Kingdom. It's a deeply important occurrence, and one that doesn't just happen by confirmation. I am striving so that all ordinances are ratified by the Holy Spirit of Promise; all ordinances must be. It's knowledge that will save us, not the lack of it. I also believe that the end of faith should be a perfect knowledge, achievable in this life.

What is it going to take in these last days to build Zion? I believe it will take all of those said principles. It starts individually. I want to live like Christ is here. Christ will dwell in Zion. I hope to be well-acquainted with His voice to help in building up Zion (3).

How is this going to be? The scriptures also talk about servants in the last days that will come out to prepare His people. I believe these servants will come in a manner like Samuel the Lamanite, Abinadi, and John the Baptist. I have learned hard lessons that it is always about the message and not the messenger. I believe the servants are now here and among us.

I'm going to be baptized again. I have been told by the Lord to do so. I was baptized when I was eight, but this time the wording will be as 3 Nephi 11:25. The church had been commissioned to baptize, but now I believe we live in days like that of Alma the younger. I'm not joining a new church, but will be among a community of believers.

But this is a crazy period of time we live in. We live in days where even the very elect can be deceived and where people seek to walk in their own ways. How can I be sure this is the right path? 

I desire and seek God's will. My journey is taking place with a covenant that I obey His voice. I can't deny the experiences I've had the past few years. I can't deny what I know is right; nor can I deny the fruit of my faith.

What about the blessings of the temple I miss out on? I believe the true purpose of the temple, as purposed for our day, is to see the Lord's face. And my marriage? God told me I would marry my wife long before I believed it to be true. Knowing that it is His will that I am with her is witness to me of the covenant I already have between God and my wife. If God preserves my marriage, it will be because it mirrors that union found in Heaven, sealed by the Holy Spirit of promise. I'm concerned for the salvation of my family, and I'm moving forward in efforts to do so. With all my weaknesses and sins, I know that only God has the power to save. I seek His voice for the salvation of my family.

I am grateful for all the church has provided to me and my family, spiritually and temporally; but I can't pretend to believe that all is well, or will be, in the church. All that Isaiah prophecies parallels our day. What he prophecies is sobering and should be alarming. What people claim to be led by a prophet? What people are a temple-going people? What people claim to be a covenant people of the Lord? I have found his words to be very valuable and of great worth to study. God wants us to learn through revelation. It is one of the necessary elements through which we act in faith (4).

I don't claim to understand my path fully at this time. I don't claim to be worthy of any of those blessings, but strive to seek them in humility, acknowledging the source of all blessings. I do know that God wants me to be baptized. I do know that God wants us to obtain those higher blessings. I hope we can seek Him and reclaim these blessings that we might bear His presence when He comes again.

(1) Elder Nelson, Oct 2014 General Conference:

Our sustaining of prophets is a personal commitment that we will do our utmost to uphold their prophetic priorities. Our sustaining is an oath-like indication that we recognize their calling as a prophet to be legitimate and binding upon us.

Trust me! These 15 men—prophets, seers, and revelators—know what the will of the Lord is when unanimity is reached!

Wilford Woodruff:

I say to Israel, the Lord will never permit me or any other man who stands as president of this Church to lead you astray. It is not in the program. It is not in the mind of God. If I were to attempt that the Lord would remove me out of my place, and so He will any other man who attempts to lead the children of men astray from the oracles of God and from their duty. ( The Discourses of Wilford Woodruff, sel. G. Homer Durham [1946], 212–13.)

I say to the Latter day Saints, the keys of the kingdom of God are here, and they are going to stay here, too, until the coming of the Son of Man. Let all Israel understand that… . No man who has ever breathed the breath of life can hold these keys of the kingdom of God and lead the people astray. ( The Discourses of Wilford Woodruff, sel. G. Homer Durham [1946], 73–74.)

(2) Joseph Smith:

...if the people departed from the Lord, they must fall—that they were depending on the Prophet, hence were darkened in their minds, in consequence of neglecting the duties devolving upon themselves.

(3) Joseph Smith:

As a Church and a people it behooves us to be wise, and to seek to know the will of God, and then be willing to do it; for “blessed is he that heareth the word of the Lord, and keepeth it,” say the Scriptures. “Watch and pray always,” says our Savior, “that ye may be accounted worthy to escape the things that are to come on the earth, and to stand before the Son of Man.” If Enoch, Abraham, Moses, and the children of Israel, and all God’s people were saved by keeping the commandments of God, we, if saved at all, shall be saved upon the same principle. As God governed Abraham, Isaac and Jacob as families, and the children of Israel as a nation; so we, as a Church, must be under His guidance if we are prospered, preserved and sustained. Our only confidence can be in God; our only wisdom obtained from Him; and He alone must be our protector and safeguard, spiritually and temporally, or we fall.

We have been chastened by the hand of God heretofore for not obeying His commands, although we never violated any human law, or transgressed any human precept; yet we have treated lightly His commands, and departed from His ordinances, and the Lord has chastened us sore, and we have felt His arm and kissed the rod; let us be wise in time to come and ever remember that “to obey is better than sacrifice, and to hearken than the fat of rams.

(4) Lectures on Faith:

[Three] things are necessary for us to understand, respecting the Deity and our relation to him, in order that we may exercise faith in him for life and salvation…What are they? First, that God does actually exist; secondly, correct ideas of his character, his perfections and attributes; and thirdly, that the course which we pursue is according to his mind and will. (Lecture 3:3-5.)

…How are we to be made acquainted with the before-mentioned things respecting the Deity, and respecting ourselves? By revelation. (Lecture 3:6.) Could these things be found out by any other means than by revelation? They could not.

EXTRA:

29 And Moses said unto him, Enviest thou for my sake? would God that all the Lord’s people were prophets, and that the Lord would put his spirit upon them!
30 And Moses gat him into the camp, he and the elders of Israel. (Numbers 11)

Ezra Taft Benson, (General Conference Oct 1967):

Yes, it is the precepts of men versus the principles of God. The more we follow the word of God, the less we are deceived, while those who follow the wisdom of men are deceived the most. Increasingly the Latter-day Saints must choose between the reasoning of men and the revelations of God. This is a crucial choice, for we have those within the Church today who, with their worldly wisdom, are leading some of our members astray. 

19 The weak things of the world shall come forth and break down the mighty and strong ones, that man should not counsel his fellow man, neither trust in the arm of flesh—
20 But that every man might speak in the name of God the Lord, even the Savior of the world;
21 That faith also might increase in the earth;
22 That mine everlasting covenant might be established;
23 That the fulness of my gospel might be proclaimed by the weak and the simple unto the ends of the world, and before kings and rulers. (D&C 1)

How Can I Be

Following Man vs Following God

The following is a very simple and clear analysis of the difference between following a prophet and following God:

1 Kings 13:8-24 & 1 Kings 17:8-24

The Man of God and the Prophet

8 And the man of God said unto the king, If thou wilt give me half thine house, I will not go in with thee, neither will I eat bread nor drink water in this place:
9 For so was it charged me by the word of the Lord, saying, Eat no bread, nor drink water, nor turn again by the same way that thou camest. 

He knew from the start what God commanded him.

10 So he went another way, and returned not by the way that he came to Beth-el.
11 ¶Now there dwelt an old prophet in Beth-el; and his sons came and told him all the works that the man of God had done that day in Beth-el: the words which he had spoken unto the king, them they told also to their father.
12 And their father said unto them, What way went he? For his sons had seen what way the man of God went, which came from Judah.
13 And he said unto his sons, Saddle me the ass. So they saddled him the ass: and he rode thereon,
14 And went after the man of God, and found him sitting under an oak: and he said unto him, Art thou the man of God that camest from Judah? And he said, I am.
15 Then he said unto him, Come home with me, and eat bread.
16 And he said, I may not return with thee, nor go in with thee: neither will I eat bread nor drink water with thee in this place:
17 For it was said to me by the word of the Lord, Thou shalt eat no bread nor drink water there, nor turn again to go by the way that thou camest.
18 He said unto him, I am a prophet also as thou art; and an angel spake unto me by the word of the Lord, saying, Bring him back with thee into thine house, that he may eat bread and drink water. But he lied unto him.
19 So he went back with him, and did eat bread in his house, and drank water. 

He took no thought to what was asked. He trusted the prophet, yet knew what God initially asked of him.

20 ¶And it came to pass, as they sat at the table, that the word of the Lord came unto the prophet that brought him back:
21 And he cried unto the man of God that came from Judah, saying, Thus saith the Lord, Forasmuch as thou hast disobeyed the mouth of the Lord, and hast not kept the commandment which the Lord thy God commanded thee,
22 But camest back, and hast eaten bread and drunk water in the place, of the which the Lord did say to thee, Eat no bread, and drink no water; thy carcase shall not come unto the sepulchre of thy fathers. 

For going against what God asked of him, he became cursed.

23 ¶And it came to pass, after he had eaten bread, and after he had drunk, that he saddled for him the ass, to wit, for the prophet whom he had brought back.
24 And when he was gone, a lion met him by the way, and slew him: and his carcase was cast in the way, and the ass stood by it, the lion also stood by the carcase. (Old Testament, 1 Kings, 1 Kings 13)

That is the fruit of following man.

Elijah and the Widow

8 ¶And the word of the Lord came unto him, saying,
9 Arise, get thee to Zarephath, which belongeth to Zidon, and dwell there: behold, I have commanded a widow woman there to sustain thee. 

The widow also was initially commanded by the Lord.

10 So he arose and went to Zarephath. And when he came to the gate of the city, behold, the widow woman was there gathering of sticks: and he called to her, and said, Fetch me, I pray thee, a little water in a vessel, that I may drink.
11 And as she was going to fetch it, he called to her, and said, Bring me, I pray thee, a morsel of bread in thine hand.
12 And she said, As the Lord thy God liveth, I have not a cake, but an handful of meal in a barrel, and a little oil in a cruse: and, behold, I am gathering two sticks, that I may go in and dress it for me and my son, that we may eat it, and die. 

She did what the Lord initially asked of her; she knew of the great sacrifice it would cost.

13 And Elijah said unto her, Fear not; go and do as thou hast said: but make me thereof a little cake first, and bring it unto me, and after make for thee and for thy son.
14 For thus saith the Lord God of Israel, The barrel of meal shall not waste, neither shall the cruse of oil fail, until the day that the Lord sendeth rain upon the earth.
15 And she went and did according to the saying of Elijah: and she, and he, and her house, did eat many days.
16 And the barrel of meal wasted not, neither did the cruse of oil fail, according to the word of the Lord, which he spake by Elijah. 

Her faith brought much fruit; but even after her faith, she endured a hard trial:

17 ¶And it came to pass after these things, that the son of the woman, the mistress of the house, fell sick; and his sickness was so sore, that there was no breath left in him.
18 And she said unto Elijah, What have I to do with thee, O thou man of God? art thou come unto me to call my sin to remembrance, and to slay my son?
19 And he said unto her, Give me thy son. And he took him out of her bosom, and carried him up into a loft, where he abode, and laid him upon his own bed.
20 And he cried unto the Lord, and said, O Lord my God, hast thou also brought evil upon the widow with whom I sojourn, by slaying her son?
21 And he stretched himself upon the child three times, and cried unto the Lord, and said, O Lord my God, I pray thee, let this child’s soul come into him again.
22 And the Lord heard the voice of Elijah; and the soul of the child came into him again, and he revived. 

The fruit of a true prophet:

23 And Elijah took the child, and brought him down out of the chamber into the house, and delivered him unto his mother: and Elijah said, See, thy son liveth.
24 ¶And the woman said to Elijah, Now by this I know that thou art a man of God, and that the word of the Lord in thy mouth is truth. (Old Testament, 1 Kings, 1 Kings 17)